NEW YORK — Among the issues on the agenda for world leaders who gathered this week for the United Nations General Assembly is Russia’s war against Ukraine. In an interview in New York with VOA’s Ukrainian Service, U.K. Foreign Secretary David Lammy said his nation stands “shoulder-to-shoulder with the Ukrainians” and will provide Ukraine with military aid for “as long as it takes” to help it “stand off this aggression.” He also cited intelligence findings that Russian President Vladimir Putin is facing mounting problems, with a deteriorating economy and mounting battlefield losses.
The following has been edited for length and clarity.
DO: Have you had the chance to discuss with your counterparts in other countries, including U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken, the issue of lifting restrictions on Ukraine using long-range Western missiles against targets inside Russia?
U.K. Foreign Secretary David Lammy: It was very important for me to be with Secretary Blinken in Ukraine just two weeks ago to see for ourselves, to discuss with [Ukrainian] President [Volodymyr] Zelenskyy … also to discuss Ukraine’s needs as they head out of the autumn into the winter, and that we continue as allies to put Ukraine in the strongest possible position to stand off this aggression that we’re seeing from Vladimir Putin.
That was why I also went to the White House with [U.K.] Prime Minister [Keir] Starmer. We remain in the U.K. absolutely clear that we stand shoulder to shoulder with the Ukrainians. It’s important that Ukraine has the finances and the money, the military aid, as well as the political, diplomatic and humanitarian aid, to get through 2025. And of course, here at the U.N. General Assembly, I will meet with Zelenskyy once again today.
But, also, it’s hugely important that we rally the Global South to ensure that they’re not falling into the trap of Russian propaganda … and efforts to destabilize [and distract] the international community … when in fact what they are doing is taking ballistic missiles from Iran to use against [Ukrainian] men, women and children.
DO: You’ve already mentioned this meeting between Prime Minister Keir Starmer and U.S. President Joe Biden in Washington. Can you share the details of the conversation?
Lammy: I do think it is very important for us in the U.K. and Europe, and of course in the United States, to understand more the details of President Zelenskyy’s “victory plan.” And over the coming days, he will present that in detail to close allies. And of course, I’m not going to speculate what’s in the papers … because I don’t want to give any advantage to Vladimir Putin.
But I am really clear that this is a time for Western allies to show nerve and guts, because Vladimir Putin thinks that we’ll get distracted. He thinks that we haven’t got the attention span to stand with our Ukrainian friends. That’s why we in the U.K. have found 3 billion pounds for Ukraine to buy and have the military equipment it needs, not just this year, [but] for every year as long as it takes. And that’s what I said to my G7 allies last night when I met with them. That’s the position we’ve got to ensure Ukraine is in.
DO: When do you think this crucial decision could be made?
Lammy: We meet here in the U.N. General Assembly. I know that President Zelenskyy is meeting with President Biden a little bit later in the week also in Washington. We will head on to the G20 [summit in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, November 18-19, 2024] as well. So, over the coming days and weeks, I expect us to be in a very strong position to ensure that Ukraine is in the best position it can be as we head into that tough winter in 2025.
And let’s just be clear about what I mean by that. All of our intelligence actually suggests things are going to get a lot tougher for Vladimir Putin as he comes out of next year. His economy is in trouble. He’s going to find it very problematic with the amount of losses and casualties that he’s taking. And actually, when you look at what Ukraine is doing — their ability to take back half the ground that’s been lost, their ability to repel him from the Black Sea, their ability to advance in Kursk and hopefully keep the ground — this is a time for Western countries to show their nerve and to be absolutely committed as we head out of the autumn into the winter period.
DO: What do you say to people, including leaders, who warn that allowing Ukraine to use long-range weapons to strike inside Russia could lead to a third world war?
Lammy: Well, we’re really clear that under the U.N. Charter and under Article 51, Ukraine has the right to defend itself, to defend itself against the horrendous attacks that are coming from Russia, and we will do all we can within international law and the rules of engagement to support Ukraine to defend itself.
DO: You said that the war between Russia and Ukraine is likely to continue for at least another two years. Will Ukraine and the West will have enough to stand so long?
Lammy: Let’s be clear: The war could end tomorrow if Putin left. That’s how it ends: Leave Ukraine. But in the absence of Putin showing any desire to negotiate, we have to continue to stand with Ukraine, because the cost of not standing with Ukraine would actually be financially far greater.
You know, defense spending would rise substantially across all Western allies, and indeed, there will be a very vulnerable Baltic frontier in relation to Putin’s threats. So, that is why we stand with Ukraine for as long as it takes. And I’m quite sure that … this war will only be settled in the end politically, of course. That also gets into the security guarantees that Ukraine needs. And we’ve always believed in the U.K. that that path to Ukraine joining NATO is a very important dimension of that security guarantee.
